zaterdag 25 mei 2013

Antizionistisch kaartspel populair bij haredi Israel

 

Er is veel ophef over Arabieren in Israel die de staat niet erkennen en de zogenaamde nakba willen herdenken, maar over ultra orthodoxe Joden die even fel tegen de staat en het zionisme ageren, hoor je veel minder. Deze mensen doen in hun felheid en extremisme niet onder voor sommige beruchte woordvoerders van de Arabische gemeenschap in Israel, en wat zij doen is niet minder verwerpelijk. Als ze zo tegen het land zijn waar ze wonen, zou je haast zeggen dat ze dan misschien ergens anders heen kunnen gaan? Bijvoorbeeld naar een Arabisch land of de Palestijnse Autoriteit, waar sommigen van hun ook banden mee hebben:

"Hatred of Zionism is no longer a marginal issue," said the distributor, a Neturei Karta man and the grandson of Moshe Hirsch, former Jewish affairs minister for the Palestinian Authority.

Het is triest dat deze mensen niet kunnen accepteren dat er een wereldlijk Joods gezag is, en dat religie en staat op de meeste terreinen zijn gescheiden. 

 

RP

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Anti-Zionist playing cards new fad in haredi sector

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4381271,00.html

Distributor says 2,000 decks sold in Lag B'Omer alone, promises to print thousands more. 'Hatred of Zionism no longer a marginal issue,' he asserts

Akiva Novick

Published: 

05.19.13, 10:31 / Israel News

Against the backdrop of the massive anti-draft haredi demonstration in Jerusalem on Thursday, new playing cards promoting anti-Zionist beliefs are gaining popularity in Israel's various orthodox communities.

 

Though they originated in the relatively marginal Neturei Karta sect, the playing cards' distributor claims they garner much enthusiasm in the haredi mainstream outside the group's Jerusalem cloister.

  

The "Teach the youth" cards are composed of a series of quartets showcasing quotes, famous figures ands events linked to anti-Zionist ideology. One card shows the State symbol, a menorah, bursting in flames above an inscription thanking God for banishing idolatry from Israel. 

 

Another quartet is themed with rabbis' remarks against the State, and another commemorates haredim whose death is attributed to police violence or to 'Zionist conspiracies.'

 

One figure who gained special note in the playing cards is the deceased rabbi Amram Blau, a Neturei Karta founder and one of the haredi sector's most revered protesters of the regime.

 

A whole quartet is devoted to Blau, who is shown mourning Independence Day and zealously protesting against the State of Israel.

 

The figures and inscriptions on the cards testify to their makers' marginality in haredi society, but the distributor told Yedioth Aharonoth that sales are up across the haredi spectrum.

 

"Hatred of Zionism is no longer a marginal issue," said the distributor, a Neturei Karta man and the grandson of Moshe Hirsch, former Jewish affairs minister for the Palestinian Authority.

 

"In a Lag Ba'Omer rally we sold 2,000 playing decks. They're for all sectors of the haredi world, and if necessary, we'll print thousands of decks more."

 

Yoelish Kraus, a member of the prominent Eda HaHaredit anti-Zionist sect, estimated on Saturday that "if the State continues persecuting haredim, hundreds of thousands will disengage from the State and join us."

 

VN: Israelisch-Palestijns conflict niet minder belangrijk dan crisis Syrië

 

Het ontbreekt de VN niet aan aandacht voor het Israelisch-Palestijns conflict, en aan aandacht voor met name alles wat Israel doet. Geen enkel conflict en geen enkel ander land mag zich in een dergelijke belangstelling verheugen. Op talloze bijeenkomsten van VN gremia zoals de mensenrechtenraad of onlangs de jaarlijkse bijeenkomst van de Wereld Gezondheids Organisatie worden slechts over een land specifieke resoluties aangenomen: Israel.  

 

Toch meent Robert Serry, de speciale VN coordinator voor het Midden Oosten vredesproces (hoeveel andere conflicten kennen zo'n coordinator?) ervoor te moeten waarschuwen dat de aandacht voor Syrië niet ten koste gaat van die voor het Israelisch-Palestijns conflict.

Hij zegt onder andere:

"Ending the conflict in Syria is a matter of great urgency and must be the top priority of the international community. At the same time, it would be mistaken, and dangerous, to assume that a resolution of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict is less important. Now is not the time to relent in our commitment to advancing the prospects for the resumption of meaningful talks towards the realization of a two-state solution. This is the time for concerted action in support of a substantive initiative lest we miss the slight opening that has been offered in recent months." (31")

Deze extreme focus op Israel-Palestina is niet gezond en vooral ook niet bevorderlijk voor de vrede. Zeker, druk van buiten kan helpen, maar juist andere problemen worden vaak veronachtzaamd wat een oplossing bemoeilijkt. De macht die de islamisten in verschillende Arabische landen naar zich toe (dreigen te) trekken, is een serieus gevaar voor de toch al moeizame verhoudingen met Israel, en zal vrede en verzoening verder bemoeilijken. De rol van religie en fundamentalisten lijkt steeds groter te worden, waarmee een pragmatische oplossing waarbij beide kanten moeten geven en nemen moeilijker wordt; immers, met god aan je zijde ben je minder geneigd tot een compromis.... 

 

RP

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Israeli-Palestinian conflict not less important than Syria crisis: UN envoy

http://www.unmultimedia.org/radio/english/2013/05/israeli-palestinian-conflict-not-less-important-than-syria-crisis-un-envoy/ 

 

LISTEN / DOWNLOAD

Robert Serry addressing the Security Council on the situation in the Middle East

 

A senior United Nations diplomat has warned the international community about the danger of focusing on the Syrian crisis at the expense of finding a resolution to Palestinian-Israeli conflict.

Robert Serry, the UN Special Coordinator for the Middle East Process briefed the Security Council on Tuesday on the situation in the region.

He said the Middle East continues to undergo a period of "grave turmoil with tragic human consequences and an uncertain outcome."

Mr. Serry said regional tensions have mounted as the bloodshed continued in Syria, while the fighting also crossed borders and UN peacekeepers in the Golan area of separation found themselves in harm's way.

 

"Ending the conflict in Syria is a matter of great urgency and must be the top priority of the international community. At the same time, it would be mistaken, and dangerous, to assume that a resolution of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict is less important. Now is not the time to relent in our commitment to advancing the prospects for the resumption of meaningful talks towards the realization of a two-state solution. This is the time for concerted action in support of a substantive initiative lest we miss the slight opening that has been offered in recent months." (31")

 

Robert Serry said there are serious and determined quiet diplomatic efforts to break the political deadlock and bring Israelis and Palestinians back to the negotiating table.

He added that the renewed effort by the United States and sustained personal engagement of the US Secretary of State John Kerry in these efforts is cause for encouragement.

Donn Bobb, United Nations.

Duration: 1'26"

 

John Kerry wil snel vredesonderhandelingen herstarten zonder bevriezing nederzettingen

 
Twee verslagen over het recente bezoek van John Kerry aan Israel. Noch Netanyahu noch Abbas waren de laatste jaren echt happig op hernieuwde vredesbesprekingen, dus ze aan de onderhandelingstafel krijgen is al een prestatie. De deelname van Livni en Lapid aan de nieuwe Israelische regering, en de toegenomen internationale druk en ongeduld, zouden hopelijk bij Netanyahu de urgentie en bij Abbas het vertrouwen kunnen vergroten. Maar de Palestijnen zullen zich dan ook inschikkelijker moeten betonen dan de afgelopen periode, waarin alleen maar eisen voorafgaand aan onderhandelingen werden gesteld.
 
De eerste prioriteit is een akkoord over de definitieve grenzen, in ruil voor het vermeende 'recht op terugkeer'. De status van Jeruzalem moet daarbij waarschijnlijk nog even buiten beschouwing blijven, want ook zonder dat netelige en zeer symbolische probleem zal het al slikken genoeg zijn voor beide partijen...
 
Wouter
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Kerry urges renewed talks, not a settlement freeze

Leaving Israel, the US secretary of state pushes for negotiations without preconditions 

http://www.timesofisrael.com/kerry-urges-renewed-talks-not-a-settlement-freeze/ 

 

  May 24, 2013, 3:16 pm

TEL AVIV, Israel (AP) — US Secretary of State John Kerry urged Israel's government on Friday to prevent further settlement construction where possible to help revitalize Middle East peace hopes, but stressed that the Jewish state and Palestinians alike should remain focused on the larger goal of restarting direct negotiations.

Explaining part of the strategy of his now 2-month-old peace initiative, Kerry said Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's government can stop only some of the settlements being built in lands contested by the Israelis and Palestinians — and in those cases it should act. Unlike in previous American-led mediation efforts, however, he stopped short of demanding a full settlement freeze and said the contentious issue could better be handled through a quick restart of direct Israeli-Palestinian negotiations.

The Palestinians have long demanded an end to such construction before returning to talks, which have hardly occurred at all in the last 4½ years. The US has supported Netanyahu's demand for negotiations to restart without preconditions — an endorsement renewed by Kerry after two days of talks in Jerusalem and Ramallah with Israeli and Palestinians leaders.

Kerry said it was important not to let settlements stand in the way of talks that could finally set borders as part of a peace agreement. Then, he said, the issue would be resolved because each side would have clear boundaries for their two states.

Despite the continued difficulties in even getting the Israelis and Palestinians back to the negotiating table, Kerry insisted he believed peace is possible.

Earlier Friday, he met Netanyahu for the second time in as many days and then spoke with outgoing Palestinian Prime Minister Salam Fayyad.

On Thursday, Kerry praised Netanyahu for the "seriousness" with which he is looking at ways to revitalize peace hopes.

Kerry's trip, however, only seemed to prompt more pessimism from Palestinian officials about chances for peace.

They say they are planning to resume their campaign of seeking membership in key international organizations as early as next month in a bid to put pressure on Israel into offering some concessions.

Without major US pressure on Israel, the outlook seems bleak. The most immediate divide concerns the issue of Israeli settlement building in the West Bank and east Jerusalem — lands that Israel conquered in the 1967 Mideast war and which the Palestinians hope to include in their state.

Last week, Kerry called Netanyahu to complain about a move to legalize four previously illegal settlements in the West Bank, according to US officials. Publicly, however, he has taken a softer touch and Palestinians are dismayed.

Kerry brought "nothing new" to his discussions Thursday with Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, lamented one Palestinian official familiar with the talks. The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn't authorized to speak publicly on the private meetings, said Palestinian expectations remain low because they see Kerry "trying to accommodate the Israelis, not pressure the Israelis."

While Palestinians have praised Kerry's efforts, they say there has been little progress ahead of what they believe to be a June 7 deadline for action. They are already beginning work on a "day-after" strategy.

And they say there is no point in negotiating while Israel continues to build Jewish settlements. More than 500,000 Israelis now live in the West Bank and east Jerusalem, making it increasingly difficult to partition the land between Israel and the Palestinians. Israel also captured the Gaza Strip in 1967, though it withdrew from the territory in 2005.

When President Barack Obama took office in 2009, he took a tough line against the settlements and prodded Israel into a partial construction freeze. But Israel refused to extend the freeze, and a short-lived round of negotiations in 2010 quickly collapsed. Obama similarly tried unsuccessfully to press Israel into accepting the 1967 lines as a baseline for talks.

Fed up with the impasse and disillusioned with Obama, the Palestinians last fall won recognition from the UN General Assembly as a nonmember state, an upgraded diplomatic status that gives them access to key UN bodies. The US was one of just eight countries that sided with Israel in opposing the bid.

Israel fears the Palestinians will now seek membership in international agencies to promote an anti-Israel agenda. Its biggest concern is that the Palestinians will try to join the International Criminal Court and try to press war crimes charges against Israel.

Copyright 2013 The Associated Press.

 

Kerry: Israel, Palestinians need to choose peace 

http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_article.php?id=9507 

Visiting Israel for fourth time in four months, U.S. secretary of state says regional players have reached a "critical moment" in the Israeli-Palestinian peace process • Palestinian officials say conditions are not yet ripe for renewal of talks with Israel.

Reuters and Israel Hayom Staff 

 

U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry held separate talks with Israeli and Palestinian officials on Thursday and acknowledged there was considerable skepticism that the two sides would resume peace negotiations. 

 

Kerry met with President Shimon Peres, who wished Kerry success in his mission. Kerry responded by saying success would be a prize for Israel and the Palestinians, not for him.

"You said that 'if you succeed' or 'if you fail' -- it's not me, Mr. President," Kerry said. "It really is a question of whether Israel and the Palestinians make the choices."

Kerry added that regional players had reached a "critical moment." 

 

There were no signs of any breakthrough as Kerry visited Israel for the fourth time in his four months in office to try to revive a peace process that has been moribund for more than two years.

Kerry also met with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Thursday. 

 

"I know this region well enough to know that there is skepticism," Kerry said as he and Netanyahu posed for pictures. "In some quarters there is cynicism and there are reasons for it. There have been bitter years of disappointment."

"It is our hope that by being methodical, careful, patient, but detailed and tenacious, that we can lay out a path ahead that can conceivably surprise people but certainly exhaust the possibilities of peace." 

 

Kerry met Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas for lunch in the West Bank city of Ramallah. Kerry was also scheduled to see Netanyahu again on Friday for breakfast.

Before his meeting with Kerry on Thursday, Netanyahu said he wanted to restart peace talks. 

 

"It's something I hope the Palestinians want as well and we ought to be successful for a simple reason -- when there's a will, we'll find a way," Netanyahu said.

The two men discussed ways to advance peace, Kerry's ideas for an economic plan to boost Palestinian growth and the "escalating violence" in neighboring Syria's civil war, a senior U.S. State Department official told reporters after the meeting. 

 

Netanyahu thanked Kerry for the U.S. House of Representatives Foreign Affairs Committee's approval of legislation to impose tighter sanctions on Iran.

Visiting British Foreign Secretary William Hague also held talks with Netanyahu and Abbas on Thursday. 

 

During his meeting with Hague, Netanyahu said that the most recent International Atomic Energy Agency report clearly showed that Iran was continuing to develop its nuclear program.

On Friday, Hague met with Peres in Jerusalem and expressed support for U.S. efforts to revive Israeli-Palestinian peace talks. Peres, in turn, praised Hague's efforts and positions.

"You have made your position extremely clear on the major issues," Peres said. "On Iran, on terror, on the need to move forward the peace process and we feel not only your clear positions but also your friendship and understanding." 

 

Hague told Peres that 70 percent of his work in foreign affairs has to do with the Middle East.

"Taking into account the situation with Iran's nuclear program and the tragic situation in Syria and, of course, our hopes now are that we can, through supporting Secretary Kerry in his work, really help to make some decisive moves forward for permanent peace," Hague said, echoing European Union support for U.S. efforts. 

 

Justice Minister Tzipi Livni, who is in charge of diplomatic negotiations, met with both Kerry and Hague on Thursday. Livni said the coming weeks would be critical to resuming talks with the Palestinians.  

"The objective is to restart negotiations and end the conflict," Livni said. "This is an American goal. It's in Israel's interest and I hope the Palestinians understand this." 

 

In Ramallah on Thursday, dozens of demonstrators greeted Kerry outside of Abbas' office, protesting "the pro-Israel tendency of the U.S."

After the meeting, Kerry stopped at a restaurant in Ramallah to eat shawarma and some traditional sweets. 

 

Israel Radio reported on Friday that Palestinian officials said conditions are not yet ripe for the renewal of negotiations with Israel. The officials said the U.S. still does not have a formulated plan to renew Israeli-Palestinian talks. 

 

Abbas is expected to meet with Kerry again on Saturday in Jordan.

 

Samenwerking tussen Palestijnse Autoriteit en Israelisch ziekenhuis

 
Palestinian Media Watch bericht ook eens iets positiefs uit de Palestijnse media; dat komt niet vaak voor. Zouden er niet meer positieve artikelen in verschijnen?
 
Wouter
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Official PA daily acknowledges Israeli hospital's medical care for Palestinian children and training of doctors

http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=157&doc_id=9049

by Itamar Marcus and Nan Jacques Zilberdik


The official PA daily reported on a visit by the PA Minister of Health, Hani Abdeen, to Israel's Hadassah Hospital in Jerusalem. The daily noted that 30% of the child patients in Hadassah are Palestinians and that the Israeli hospital is training "60 Palestinian medical interns and specialist physicians who will be returning to the [Palestinian] Authority areas to carry out their work." The hospital has a special program to train Palestinian doctors to treat cancer among children, reported the PA daily.

The following is the report:

"[PA] Minister of Health, Hani Abdeen visited the [Israeli] Hadassah Hospital yesterday [May 5, 2013]. This is the first visit by a Palestinian minister to one of the most important Israeli hospitals, according to the hospital's announcement.
Minister Abdeen who was accompanied by a delegation that included senior officials of the ministry and of the PA, met with the Director of Ein Karem Hadassah Hospital, Yuval Weiss. He [the minister] visited Palestinian patients being treated in the hospital, and he distributed gifts. [Hospital director] Weiss said: 'We relate to patients without regard to nationality and religion. We treat Muslims, Christians, Jews, and other nationalities without bias, and 30% of the patients who are children are Palestinians.'
He went on to say: 'We've begun cooperating with the Palestinians. We now train teams of physicians from the hospital in Beit Jala in the southern West Bank, to treat cancer among children. We have about 60 Palestinian medical interns and specialist physicians who will be returning to the [Palestinian] Authority areas to carry out their work.'"

[Al-Hayat Al-Jadida, May 6, 2013]

 

This article documenting Israel's medical care for Palestinian children is a change from common PA accusations that Israel intentionally tries to hurt Palestinians, for example by spreading drugs intentionally among Palestinian youth. 

 

 

Wel niet wel niet: warboel rond Made in Israel-etikettering (CIDI)

 
Gaan Nederland en de EU producten uit Israelische nederzettingen op de Westoever voorzien van aparte herkomst etiketten? De intentie is er, maar het is in de praktijk nog niet zo makkelijk. De EU is gehouden aan allerlei internationale verdragen, en bovendien moet wat voor Moshe geldt ook gelden voor Hassan en Mohammed, en wellicht zelfs voor Liang. Marokko en Turkije (bijv.) houden immers ook omstreden gebieden bezet, en met China (made in Tibet?) wil niemand ruzie.
 
Alle gedoe zou intussen gaan om niet meer dan 1% van de producten die Israel naar Europa exporteert.
 
Zie eerder:
 
Wouter
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Komt er een verbod op het voeren van Made in Israel-etiketten op producten uit de nederzettingen, en wanneer en hoe dan?

Vorig jaar mei besloot de EU dat producten uit nederzettingen hier niet meer zo'n etiket mogen krijgen. Over het wel of niet doorvoeren van dat verbod werd de laatste paar dagen een warboel van tegenstrijdige berichten de wereld in geslingerd, ook vanuit Nederland.

Niet

Op 3 mei dit jaar berichtte het NRC Handelsblad op basis van 'bronnen rond het kabinet' dat het kabinet plannen hiervoor op de lange baan had geschoven, om een conflict in de coalitie te voorkomen. Ook zou Amerika aan Europa hebben gevraagd de zaak op te schorten.

Wel

Gisteren deed minister Timmermans deze berichten in een debat van de Buitenlandcommissie van de Tweede Kamer af als "broodjeaapverhalen". Hij is niet van plan het verbod uit te stellen. "Ik ga die afspraak gewoon nakomen", zei Timmermans donderdag in een commissiedebat. „Nederland is ook gehouden Europese afspraken op dit punt na te komen", tekende het Reformatorisch Dagblad uit zijn mond op. De stand voor Nederland is dus: 'gewoon' wel een verbod. Volgens de berichten van gisteren.
Timmermans heeft echter wel met elf collega's zijn EU-tegenhanger Catherine Ashton in een brief gevraagd om Europese richtlijnen voor de etiketteringskwestie. Al spreekt hij van "ik", Timmermans zal de maatregel waarschijnlijk slechts in EU-verband uitvoeren.

Toch niet

Wat de EU betreft: net drie dagen voor de 'broodjeaap'-uitspraak van Timmermans, op 20 mei, berichtte onder meer Ha'aretz dat de EU het etiketteerverbod zou hebben uitgesteld op verzoek van de Amerikaanse minister van Buitenlandse Zaken John Kerry. Kerry is in de regio om het vredesproces vlot te trekken en sprak vandaag met premier Netanyahu (dit gesprek ging overigens over de situatie in Syrië, die door iedereen als veel dringender wordt ervaren). Intussen zou Kerry EU-buitenlandcoördinator Catherine Ashton om uitstel van het verbod hebben gevraagd; een verbod zou Kerry's vredespogingen hinderen. De stand in de EU was dus op 20 mei: nog even geen verbod.

Toch wel

Op 22 mei, één dag voor de uitspraak van Timmermans, berichtten de media dat de EU het verbod niet zou uitstellen. En later die dag heette het iets voorzichtiger 'dat de EU de mogelijkheid voor een andere etikettering van nederzettingenproducten nog bestudeert, maar niet had besloten de maatregel uit te stellen'.

Hoe dan?

De reden voor dit gezwalk is, dat de EU ondanks alle principiële uitspraken een dergelijk verbod niet zomaar kan invoeren zonder in botsing te komen met internationale verdragen en het verbod op (economische) discriminatie. De EU heeft verdragen met verschillende landen, waaronder Israel, over een gunstig douanetarief. In tegenstelling tot wat wel wordt beweerd, gelden deze gunstige douanevoorwaarden al jaren niét voor producten uit de nederzettingen.
Voor de uitvoering van deze verdragen is het nodig afspraken te maken over de herkomst van producten die niet op één plek van A tot Z zijn gemaakt. De afspraak is, dat de plaats waar de producten worden afgewerkt geldt als plaats van herkomst. Dat wil zeggen dat bijvoorbeeld wijn van druiven uit de Golan, die binnen de Groene Lijn wordt gebotteld, ook na de invoer van het etiketteerverbod nog steeds het etiket Made in Israel zou mogen dragen. Het etiketteerverbod zou dus alleen gelden voor producten die van A tot Z in een nederzetting zijn gemaakt – volgens Israel 1% van de export.
Als de EU nu alleen voor Israel deze verdragen zou willen verbreken, dan zou dit economische discriminatie zijn. Want ook andere landen met wie de EU deze verdragen heeft, namelijk Turkije en Marokko, houden omstreden gebieden bezet. Om de beschuldiging van economische discriminatie af te weren, zou een wijziging van de regels voor Israel dus ook voor deze landen moeten gelden. Maar dat is niet wat de EU wil.

Symboolpolitiek

De EU kan niet anders handelen dan op basis van non-discriminatie. Als Israel een verbod krijgt op Made in Israel-etiketten voor producten uit bezet gebied, dan moet hetzelfde gelden voor Marokko en Turkije. Ook mogen de regels voor herkomst niet anders worden toegepast voor Israel dan voor andere landen waarmee EU verdragen heeft. Gebeurt dat wel, dan kan Israel met succes een beroep doen op het Europese hof tegen deze discriminatie.
Dat is het dilemma dat de EU op dit moment bestudeert. Die studie kan nog wel enige tijd in beslag nemen. En als de EU daarna in dit alles behoorlijk zou handelen, zou het resultaat een wijziging zijn van de etiketten op maximaal 1% van de Israelische export. Dat zou geen enkele aansporing zijn tot een stopzetting van de bouw in de nederzettingen.

 

vrijdag 24 mei 2013

Olmert over afwijzing vredesvoorstel Abbas in 2008

 

Van Palestijnse zijde wordt beweerd dat Abbas wel bereid was over het plan te praten, en dat Olmert bovendien politiek nogal zwak stond en het plan het daarom waarschijnlijk toch niet gehaald zou hebben in Israel. Dat wordt overigens ook over Baraks vergaande vredesvoorstellen gezegd. Het is een makkelijk argument, want wanneer Barak of Olmert Palestijnse steun voor hun plannen hadden gekregen had dit hun populariteit ook verhoogd. Beiden waren gekozen omdat zij vrede wilde sluiten met de Palestijnen en werde mede afgerekend op het falen wat dat betreft. Olmert zelf zegt over de Palestijnse tegenwerpingen:

“I know all of their arguments,” said Olmert. “They say that Abu Mazen agreed with [George W.] Bush that [chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb] Erakat would meet with [Olmert's diplomatic adviser Shalom] Turjeman in early January in Washington, but that was a few days before Bush left the White House and we received no such invitation. They claim that it was because I was finished politically, so [Abbas] hesitated. But that is an excuse after the fact. They [the Palestinians] were very worried. Abu Mazen (Abbas) is not a big hero. They were afraid. Erakat was worried. In the end they thought that maybe after the American elections they would get more from President Obama.”

Wat ik in het vorige bericht hierover vergat op te merken, is dat het voorstel ook een deling van Jeruzalem inhield en gemeenschappelijke controle over de Tempelberg.

In the interview, Olmert reconfirms that he was ready to relinquish sovereignty in the Old City, divide Jerusalem, and give the Palestinians the entire West Bank with one-for-one land swaps to retain major settlements. He also goes into new details about his proposal for resolving Palestinian refugee demands.

Ik verwacht niet dat het NOS journaal er vanavond mee opent, maar de wonderen zijn de wereld nog niet uit, dus ik laat me graag verrassen.... 

 

RP

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Abbas failed to accept my peace offer because he’s ‘no hero’

Ehud Olmert offers new details of his 2008 Palestinian statehood proposal, addresses refugee absorption within the Green Line

 

 

http://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas-failed-to-accept-my-peace-offer-because-hes-no-hero/

  May 24, 2013, 12:17 pm 2

More than four years after he offered the Palestinians a state with a sovereign share of Jerusalem and 100% of the West Bank, with some one-for-one land swaps, former prime minister Ehud Olmert accused PA President Mahmoud Abbas of lacking the guts to take the deal.

In an interview with The Tower website, Olmert said he was familiar with all “the arguments” that the Palestinians have put forward for failing to seize the best offer Israel has ever made for a permanent accord, but that the bottom line is that Abbas is no hero and that the Palestinians were afraid.

“I know all of their arguments,” said Olmert. “They say that Abu Mazen agreed with [George W.] Bush that [chief Palestinian negotiator Saeb] Erakat would meet with [Olmert's diplomatic adviser Shalom] Turjeman in early January in Washington, but that was a few days before Bush left the White House and we received no such invitation. They claim that it was because I was finished politically, so [Abbas] hesitated. But that is an excuse after the fact. They [the Palestinians] were very worried. Abu Mazen (Abbas) is not a big hero. They were afraid. Erakat was worried. In the end they thought that maybe after the American elections they would get more from President Obama.”

In the interview, Olmert reconfirms that he was ready to relinquish sovereignty in the Old City, divide Jerusalem, and give the Palestinians the entire West Bank with one-for-one land swaps to retain major settlements. He also goes into new details about his proposal for resolving Palestinian refugee demands.

Olmert told Abbas that he was willing to absorb 5,000 refugees over five years, inside the Green Line.

“Why 5,000? It may sound kind of strange, but during the talks between Rice and Abu Mazen he said that he needed the settlement of tens of thousands of refugees inside Israel, and that Ehud Barak had been ready to take in 100,000. She told him that he could get the same number of people as could fit inside the Muqata’a at any given moment. We estimated that number to be about 5,000. So that’s how I came up with the number.

“I’m telling you, if Abu Mazen had been ready to sign on an agreement that would require our absorbing 10,000-15,000 over five years, I would have agreed,” the former prime minister told The Tower.

Abbas’s hasty sketch of Olmert’s proposal, which includes no place names, indicates that Olmert was apparently willing to more or less return to the pre-1967 lines, while maintaining the Gush Etzion settlement bloc south of Jerusalem, the settlement city of Ma’aleh Adumim to the east, and a slice of territory that apparently would encompass the large settlement of Ariel in Samaria. In exchange for expanding Israeli sovereignty to those areas, Israel would have given up some of its own land to the new Palestinian state. 

 

A sketch of the land for peace offer made by former Prime Minister Ehud Olmert to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in December 2008. The mape was hand-drawn by Abbas. (photo credit: Walla News)

According to the website Walla, Olmert envisaged relinquishing Israeli territory on a one-for-one basis to the Palestinians in areas including near Afula; near Tirat Zvi, south of Beit She’an; north of Jerusalem; in the Judean Desert; and in the Lachish area. He also endorsed a tunnel route to link Gaza and the West Bank.

Olmert, as he has subsequently confirmed, was also prepared to divide Jerusalem into Israeli- and Palestinian-controlled neighborhoods, and to relinquish Israeli sovereignty on the Temple Mount and the entire Old City. He proposed that the “Holy Basin” be overseen instead by a five-member, non-sovereign international trusteeship, comprising Israel, the PA, Jordan, the US and Saudi Arabia.

After the September 16, 2008, meeting where Olmert’s far-reaching proposal was offered to Abbas, the former prime minister tried to formalize an agreement immediately.

“We asked them to meet the following day, Wednesday, together with map experts, in order to arrive at a final formula for the border between Palestine and Israel,” Olmert said.

Erakat called Turjeman and said they could not meet because they “had forgotten that Abbas had to go to Amman!” Erakat said they would meet the following week.

“I am still waiting for a phone call from him,” the former prime minister said this week, referring to the PA president.

 

Abbas tekent schets van landaanbod Olmert 2008

 

Oud premier Olmer was bereid heel ver te gaan voor vrede, te ver volgens sommigen. Dit was al langer bekend, sinds jaren geleden al kaarten opdoken van Olmerts vredesvoorstellen waaruit bleek dat hij de Palestijnen nagenoeg 100% van de Westoever en de Gazastrook aanbood (om precies te zijn: 6,3% van de Westoever waar de grote nederzettingenblokken liggen zou worden geruild tegen 5,8% gebied in Israel), maar werd door de mainstream media genegeerd. Nu is daarbij een door Abbas getekende kaart opgedoken van het voorstel, dat dit bevestigt. Abbas heeft nooit officieel gereageerd op dit voorstel maar heeft de Washington Post in 2009 verteld dat het onvoldoende was. Wel hebben de Palestijnen een tegenvoorstel gedaan waarin een landruil van 1,9% werd voorgesteld. Dit voorstel kwam prominent in het NOS journaal en werd gepresenteerd als een zeer vergaand voorstel waaruit blijkt dat de Palestijnen vrede willen. Over Israels voorstel werd gezwegen. 

 

RP

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Hand-drawn map shows what Olmert offered for peace

Hastily drawn 2008 sketch by Abbas, made public for the first time, illustrates former prime minister’s dramatic territorial proposal for ‘Palestine’

 

 

http://www.timesofisrael.com/hand-drawn-map-shows-what-olmert-offered-for-peace/

  May 23, 2013, 2:26 pm 17

 

Then-prime minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in Jerusalem, Novermber 2008. (photo credit: Moshe Milner GPO/Flash90)

A sketched map of Israeli prime minister Ehud Olmert’s land-for-peace offer to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in 2008 — hurriedly drawn up by Abbas after a meeting with Olmert that December, and made public for the first time on Thursday — suggests that Israel was prepared to withdraw to borders very similar to the pre-1967 lines and swap areas of northern and southern Israel in return for maintaining the larger settlement blocs.

The map, published by Walla news in Hebrew and at TheTower.org in English, was based on an offer Olmert made to Abbas on December 16, 2008, during a meeting in Jerusalem. Olmert presented Abbas with a large formal map showing his territorial compromise proposal for the contours of a Palestinian state as part of a permanent peace accord, and demanded that Abbas initial the proposal before taking it back to Ramallah for consideration by the Palestinians. Abbas refused to do so, but on his return to his headquarters, he gathered his officials and asked them to remain silent while he hastily recreated the offer on a sheet of official Palestinian Authority notepaper.

The sketch, which includes no place names, indicates that Olmert was apparently willing to more or less return to the pre-1967 lines, while maintaining the Gush Etzion settlement bloc south of Jerusalem, the settlement city of Ma’ale Adumin to the east, and a slice of territory that apparently would encompass the large settlement of Ariel in Samaria. In exchange for expanding Israeli sovereignty to those areas, Israel would have given up some of its own land to the new Palestinian state.

According to Walla, Olmert envisaged relinquishing Israeli territory on a one-for-one basis to the Palestinians in areas including near Afula; near Tirat Zvi south of Beit She’an; north of Jerusalem; in the Judean Desert, and in the Lachish area. He also endorsed a tunnel route to link Gaza and the West Bank.

Olmert, as he has subsequently confirmed, was also prepared to divide Jerusalem into Israeli- and Palestinian-controlled neighborhoods, and to relinquish Israeli sovereignty at the Temple Mount and the entire Old City. He proposed that the “Holy Basin” be overseen instead by a five-member, non-sovereign international trusteeship, comprising Israel, the PA, Jordan, the US and Saudi Arabia.

A sketch of the land for peace offer made by former Prime Minister Ehud Olmert to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in December 2008. The map was hand-drawn by Abbas. (photo credit: Walla News)

According to Walla, Olmert has confirmed that Abbas’s sketched map is similar to that depicted in his proposal, and reconfirmed his readiness to have relinquished sovereignty at the Temple Mount.

The map shows no Israeli presence in the Jordan Valley. Walla said Olmert confirmed he was ready to forgo an Israeli presence in the Jordan Valley — a key strategic area, control of which Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has defined as vital to Israel’s security. In return, Walla cited Olmert as saying, Israel expected full security cooperation with Jordan.

In March, the New Republic reported that in September 2008 Abbas was close to signing an agreement that would have seen him give up on the so-called “right of return” for Palestinian refugees and their descendants beyond a symbolic number of several thousand. 

 

Overall in recent years, Olmert has been widely reported to have proposed that Israel annex some 6.3 percent of the West Bank to encompass the key settlements, and compensate the Palestinians with a corresponding 5.8% of territory from within Israel, plus the corridor linking Gaza to the West Bank. The Palestinians have been reported to have countered with a proposal for a far smaller, 1.9% land swap. Abbas told the Washington Post in 2009 that Olmert’s offer was insufficient. “The gaps were wide,” he said.

 

Some analysts suggest Abbas backed out at the time in large part because he believed that Olmert, who had announced that he planned to resign in order to fight corruption allegations, did not have the political clout to see the deal through. Others see Abbas’s failure to seize the most far-reaching offer even made by an Israeli prime minister as proof that no offer that Israel might reasonably make would be accepted by the Palestinian leadership.

Publication of the map Thursday drew a sharp response from Deputy Minister Ofir Akunis (Likud), a staunch Netanyahu loyalist who acts as a liaison between the government and the Knesset. Akunis said that what he called the PA’s rejection of the Olmert offer shows that the Palestinians are not really interested in peace.

“It is further proof that the argument is not about Judea and Samaria [the West Bank] but on the very existence of Israel,” Akunis told Walla. “Even though Olmert sold out on everything, gave in, for nothing in return, the Palestinians didn’t accept the offer. Their continued refusal of even the most generous offer should present a warning sign to the whole world: The Palestinians are the obstacle to peace.”

Olmert has said that Abbas did not accept the offer but also did not specifically reject it. Rather, according to Olmert, Abbas failed to respond to it.